Welcome back, everyone. Welcome back to Rocky Talk. This is a podcast where we talk about anything and everything. Rocky horror related. Aaron Nicky. How are you doing today? Oh, man, I'm doing great, John. This has been a fun week. I've been wrapping up all of my holiday stuff. I uh just 3D printed some Christmas ornaments. I made some little among us figurines that pop open and like have the guts inside of them. They're super cute. Those are going on our tree this year. Uh I still got to get that all set up but you know, I I'm getting close, I'm almost ready for, for Christmas time. I'm excited. It's the Christmas episode. I hate Christmas and everything to do with the holidays. But I love, I love a little holiday flair when it comes to shows. So I'm gonna be very festive this episode. I'm gonna jingle some bells. Have a little Holly Jolly chat. We'll see how it goes. We'll see how it goes. How are you? This week was like a really big blur for me. I don't remember what I did like all week. Are you? Ok, John, I don't think so. Your fun facts for the past three weeks have been, like, I have no recollection of the week. I am so exhausted. I think I'm gonna die. And, like, I haven't had a drop of water in a year. I'm worried about you. Like, I'm very 2020. Right. Yeah, I, um, yeah, I don't know. Like, I mean, everything just kind of, like, blurred together. Like I worked and then I streamed on Twitch and then on Sundays, I'm here like I don't, I don't really do anything with my life, but at the same time, I'm always busy. I wish I was more interesting. I'm sorry for everyone who's listening to this. So let's get over the hump of the fact that John is like the most boring person on the planet and let's get into some global news, shall we? All right. So starting off global news this week, uh Craig mclaughlin's trial wrapped up and I gotta say this was a little anti climactic in my opinion. For those of you who aren't familiar. Craig mclaughlin is the actor who played Franken Furter in the Australian touring version of the Rocky Horror Show from 2013 to 2014. He's been on trial for the past several months on charges of assaulting and indecently assaulting four of his co stars for those of you who may not know in Australia assault occurs when someone uses unwanted physical force against a victim. An indecent assault is an assault that is sexual in nature. These allegations came out against mclaughlin in 2018 regarding incidents that took place during the show's tour in 2014 this week, he was found not guilty on all charges by the magistrate Belinda Wellington who wrote and published a 105 page decision about all the reasons she was legally required to give the ruling of not guilty. 100 5 page decision is literally her being like, trust me, I'm mad about this too. I'm gonna let you finish. But boy, I don't want to do this. Yeah, exactly. So the caveat here is that all of these alleged assaults took place back in 2014 and under Australian law in 2014, the laws for assault and indecent assault, very much favored the defendants. They were very focused on the state of mind that mclaughlin was in basically a person who thought that they had consent would not be guilty of sexual assault no matter whether the belief was reasonable or unreasonable. So the magistrate said she was unable to beyond a reasonable doubt that mclaughlin didn't know the women that he was touching were not consenting. It doesn't look like this ruling was made lightly at all. Magistrate Wellington did her due diligence when fact finding for this case and she very thoroughly interviewed all four women involved in the alleged assaults. And while she found most of the testimony against mclaughlin to be completely credible. There just wasn't enough evidence to find him guilty under the 2014 law, which is really fucking annoying and I'm very mad about it, but I digress, Wellington made a point of noting in her decision that under the law as it currently stands, mclaughlin might well have been found guilty of the charges as quote, an objective view of his conduct would give rise to a strong inference that he did not reasonably believe that the accuser was consenting end quote. However, Wellington was required to follow the laws as they stood at the time the alleged assaults took place. So we feel it's also worth noting that mclaughlin did in fact admit to a number of the allegations against him, claiming that he believed the women to be consenting. So as we've said before, this is all pretty gross stuff. We're not going to go into the nitty gritty of the allegations, but they are all laid out in detail in the article that we've linked in our show notes that discusses the court's decision. So if you're interested, it's very thorough, has a lot of information on the case. And like while the outcome here is really upsetting the silver lining is that the Australian laws allowing this sort of behavior to continue were actually changed back in 2015. So the legal system is making progress and will hopefully be able to better protect victims in the future. It's definitely promising that their lawmakers were able to recognize how unbalanced this particular law was and have already taken steps to make it easier for victims to speak up for themselves. Did you guys see Cox's recent interview? I did see this but I hadn't looked at it too closely. So she dropped a bomb in her interview with deadline this week. She was being interviewed to talk about the New Netflix documentary disclosure and the representation of trans people in the media sometimes being more negative than positive. You know, like we talked about in last week's episode. But during the interview, Laverne shared a pretty shocking experience she had during her time filling the R H P S 2016 reboot and she seemed pretty nervous to be going public with this story. For the first time in the interview, Laverne recounts a day that the cast brought this legendary photographer to set to photograph the cast. She talks about how this photographer would say like super unacceptable things while shooting in order to create like a provocative atmosphere, you know, kind of like method acting. But for photography, including telling his subjects to say my name and referring to them as cock suckers. Oh, yeah. Can you imagine like being at work and having somebody come in to like, like photograph for like, I don't know, like promotional material and just start calling you a cock sucker in the middle of it. Like I'm here to shoot your promo photos cock sucker. Let's go. So, Laverne talks about how everyone on set thought the photographer's behavior was like a little odd. Sort of just kind of laughed it off because it was kind of harmless, albeit just weird. But then she says there was a moment when he was photographing me and he kept getting my pronouns wrong. I corrected him. I told him it's, she, he had photographed Iggy Pop and David Bowie back in the day and he was like, oh Iggy Pop and David Bowie, they were all he, she and I'm like, all due respect to both of them. They're not here. I'm here. I prefer my pronouns. Damn. Right. Honestly. Right. During the interview, Laverne talks about how in the past she had experienced a lot of discomfort in speaking up for herself on set, but that this time she felt emboldened to speak out for herself. So she says, and this is a direct quote from the article, I think the reason I was very comfortable, first of all was that he mis gendered me. I was number one on the call sheet. I think it was because I was starring in the film that I felt a little more emboldened to correct him. And I was like, I refuse to be mis gendered on a film that I'm starring in. I was like, you're not going to do this. And then he called me a tar baby who fucking Christ. Yeah, absolutely. That's like 50 shades of fucked up. Holy shit. I mean, good job for her for sticking up for herself. Anyone would have to in that kind of situation. Wow. Ok. So Laverne did make a point of noting that she was totally backed up in that moment, the director Kenny Ortega and everyone on set did everything that they were supposed to do. She says that they fully supported her. But in this interview, she seemed really surprised and honestly sad to have to say this experience happened on the set of Rocky Horror of all fucking places. Through the rest of the interview, Laverne goes on to talk about the importance of making sure trans people as well as members of any other underrepresented community, make their voices heard when someone's doing the wrong thing and being a piece of shit as well as how tremendously important it is for these groups to be represented in the media in a realistic way Laverne doesn't ever actually name the photographer in this interview. Do we know who it is? Uh I mean, we definitely can't say for sure without a confirmation, but we do know that Mick Rock visited the, let's do the time warp again, set to photograph the casting crew in 2016. He is certainly a legendary photographer and he did shoot David Bowie and Iggy Pop. I can't imagine how many other people would fit that description, isn't he? The guy who took all those really famous pictures from the original set. His photos have been absolutely invaluable to the Rocky community, especially when it comes to costuming. It really sucks. And honestly, it is a little sad to find out that he is yet again another famous person who is a piece of shit, but good for Laverne for speaking out. Her entire interview was really informative and she had a lot of very insightful stuff to say in regard to her own experiences as a black trans actor. If you're interested in reading the whole interview, it's going to be linked in our show notes. So on the topic of interviews, what about Cher's interview this week? Did you guys see that one? Yes, it was so sweet. Most of the piece was about her experience supporting her son Chaz through his coming out and transitioning. She spoke about how it was actually really difficult for her at first, but she was able to come to terms with the fact that her child transitioning didn't equate to her, losing him. It was nice to see someone with such a big platform. Talk about the issue from that perspective because it's definitely something that a lot of parents of trans people struggle with. Towards the end of the interview, Cher mentions that she's going to be returning to directing and that it has something to do with the Rocky Horror show. So excited. I'm so excited. Oh That's super cool. Wait, what is it? That's it. That's it. Cher is going to be directing something rocky horror related and we have no idea what there aren't any more clues, but Jesus Christ, it is going to be insane. Whatever it is. Wow, that's awesome. I mean, Cher doesn't have all that much directorial experience. She's got like five credits on her I M DB page. The last one being her own best of compilation video from like 2004. And before that, I mean, it's like TV, movies. You know, if these walls could talk from 1996 regardless of her directorial experience. I'm in love with Cher. I grew up listening to Cher because my mom is a really big Cher fan. So I by proxy, I'm a really big share fan so she could literally just like take a shit on a stage and I would clap. So this is gonna be really interesting to watch. I love having one of my loves fuse with another one of my loves. Like, it's Cher, I feel like she can only be a massive asset to any Rocky related project that she works on. I'm surprised that she hasn't done anything with Rocky honestly. Yeah, like in her like massive career, she hasn't touched anything Rocky horror related. Like this is gonna be incredible. Everybody stay tuned for updates on this because 2021 is going to be a very interesting year. Another quick article here in global news. If you're a Rocky horror themed makeup person. Wicked Sisters just launched their new Let's Do The Time Warp collection. So if y'all don't know, Wicked Sisters is a cruelty free and vegan makeup line for the Wicked and The Spooky, which is probably everybody who's listening to the podcast right now. 100% overlap. It was founded back in 2017 by two best girl friends. I need to take a, I need to take a bath after saying that and their mission is to create wicked makeup for bold and beautiful looks on lovely ghouls all year round. The collection includes an eyeshadow palette containing 15 eyeshadows, five glitter shades, six shimmers and four mats with names like wedding garter belt top hat and double feature. They've also got four shades of highly pigmented lipstick and a set of lashes that could absolutely be worn as magenta lashes on stage. They're huge and fluffy and just so on brand. So if you're still looking for a last minute holiday gift for yourself or another makeup junkie in your life, check out the link in our show notes. It's so cute. The two of you see our pals Kelly and Leandra over at Rocky by minute. Got an article in Metro Weekly. Yes, I did. It was super cute. They talked about their introductions to the Rocky community, how the theater closures left a gap in their lives that only more Rocky could fill. Not nothing we can relate to. Uh and that they started up the first ever minute by minute podcast for Rocky Horror. I think we're all feeling that void. Honestly, I know it's a huge part of why we're doing this show. Yeah. So for those of you who don't know, a minute by minute podcast is a show that covers a piece of media. It's almost always a movie and breaks it down as you might think minute by minute chronologically. So that each episode delves really deep into one or two minutes each show. So one week you might cover the first minute of the time warp and just go into the minutia of everything that takes place. They've also recruited a bunch of special guests that they have on their show this week. They're going to have Barry Bostwick host their special Christmas episode that drops on December 25th. I hear he's gonna play Santa Claus right now. Kelly and Leandra are about 1/4 of the way through the movie on their show. They're very much looking forward to being able to get back on stage as we all are. But for now, they're anticipating that it'll take another nine months or so to make it through the end of our H P S. By which point we'll at least hopefully be close to performing again, fingers, crossed, pray, do whatever you have to do. Get us back on stage, please. All of you should definitely check out their podcast. It's a lot of fun. It's very in depth. And if you're looking for an intense rocky fix, you will totally get a kick out of Rocky by minute. In fact, don't we have a promo for them in our episode this week? Hi, I'm Kelly and I'm Leandra and we host Rocky Horror Minute, the podcast where we discuss the Rocky Horror Picture show in excruciating detail. One minute at a time, we're doing this show to share our love of the lyrics. You've never seen a prune in real life? No, not the same with Raisins, right? Our passion for performance. Oh my God. I was like bad knees stupid. Sober into detail. I know that everybody's curious. That car is a 1964 Ford Falcon Deluxe Sedan Ford or 54 D and to unlock secrets that would otherwise be lost to time. Oh, are you asking if I know the name of the cheetah and why it had such a problem with the snake? Visit us on the web at Rocky horror minute dot com. For more information or look for us on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, youtube or wherever you get your podcasts. Marketing. And with that, we are going to be transitioning over to community do Yeah. The ordinary kids held their encore performance this past weekend and I got to say the blooper reel was just as fun as I hoped it would be even more. Honestly, I love the cabaret style performances up top and the virtual show itself really held up to multiple viewings. It stays fun. Yeah, the blooper reel and behind the scenes footage really showcased how much work went into this whole show. Just seriously watching them green screen, all of the actors individually was crazy. They must have ended up with a ton of footage at the end of the recording and then edited it all together. That must have taken so much time and just so much dedication. They also hinted at more performances to come in 2021 which I know we are all looking forward to watching. I also thought it was so sweet that they dedicated the performance to Adrian's mom and dad. I teared up a little bit when they showed the memorial picture. Yeah, that was very, very sweet. And just a reminder to all of our listeners, Adrian's family has a go fund me set up to help them cover costs of final arrangements for her mom, Joanne if you have the means and you would like to help them out. The gofundme is listed at the very top of our show notes. Community is amazing and generous and we know all of you will help out if you can big hugs to all of our friends at the ordinary kids. You guys put on a great show and you should all be really proud. So now we're going to transition over into Rocky Talk. He's back. Hey, we got two whole write ins this week. And our first one was from Jill who runs at Rocky H P S on Instagram. Please go follow it. It's a fantastic fan account. Uh She actually sent us two messages this week. One right after the other. The first one we're going to be discussing in our next segment, but here's the second one. So name Jill message. I hate to spam y'all. But in my question, I didn't even consider to actually give myself a shout out. So I hate to be that person, but you do always say to write in if we're working on some kind of Rocky horror related project. And I certainly am about a month ago, I started a little Instagram account. It's called at Rocky H P S Creative. I know I do my best to post behind the scene, photos, resources to learn more and other things to interact with fellow fans. I'm currently doing a bracket of the songs from Rocky Horror where everyone gets to vote on their favorites, et cetera, et cetera. Basically, I'm doing my best to spread Rocky horror knowledge through Instagram because I haven't seen many other Rocky horror picture show fan accounts on Instagram other than the shadow casts, of course, which is why I made the account to reach the demographic of fans who are on Instagram, but maybe not places like Facebook or even just Rocky Horror websites, probably mainly younger people. No offense. Of course. Hey that was, that was to you, Nicky. Um Yeah. So now that I'm done with all that self promotion, I just want to add that. I love your pod. Can't wait to hear more. And again, my account is at Rocky H P S Best Wishes, Jill oh I as short as pod. Yeah. Um I freaking love Joe. She comes into my stream on Twitch all the time and is such a sweetheart to talk to and to get to know and what not like Joe. We love your Instagram. I love you. We really appreciate all the shout outs to. You've been giving our show, everyone if you love Rocky horror content, which I assume you do because you're listening to this fucking podcast, you should totally go check out at Rocky H P S on Instagram. It's a really, really, really good time. Yeah. Thank you so much for writing in Jill. I love your page. You've got super entertaining content and such a cute aesthetic. Like tell me if I'm wrong here, but like her account is so pleasing to look at. She has like a very cool theme that she follows. But anyway, I'm so glad that we're finally getting to help spread the word about your project after you've been so helpful in promoting our show these past few months. Also, I think we might be destined to be best friends. So like maybe shoot me ad M. My name is Nicky. I'm 19 I like long walks on the beach. That's a different social media platform. Nicky, that's not Instagram. That's the content you post on your only fan. Hey, anyway, uh Jill, no, you're awesome. Your account is a lot of fun. I absolutely love seeing behind the scenes photos, this kind of stuff. I love the consistency, the theme. It's difficult to create this kind of content and you're knocking it out of the park. I love you. We've got a second message here and it is from, you guessed it, it is from our bestie. The one and only sens, I mean. Yeah. No, I'm excited. I think that we should all be a little appreciative of sins. He was, in fact our first person to write in. We owe him something. If not just courtesy of respect. Yeah, Aaron owes him a drink. That's fair. I do owe him a drink. All right. Well, here's this new message and um you know, it, it's a little higher brow this time. So uh name I fart on this question. Maybe, maybe not, maybe, maybe, maybe not, maybe this time. All right. Well, I'm just gonna read this and honestly I'm gonna read it straight through and meg you can figure out what the fuck is good. And OK in here. So here we go, Snus writes. How very dare you? The grand Master Poba will not be censored. Never in my life. Have I been so insulted? Take some white out to Hamlet. Why don't you sigh fine. I will stifle my creativity for your sensitivities also. What the fuck Aaron? At first you call me your bestie and then later tell me to fuck myself. I will and by gum I did. You're dead to me. I can't wait for you to die for reals so I can dance naked on your grave making a sludge of my own viscus material and your burial dirt. Anyway, my, my, my, my, my, my, my Nicky little Nicky darling, Nicky. So sorry, you were so Nicky furious that I hadn't mentioned your name in the nick of time. But let's get Nicky at night. Now, my name, I'm gonna have to see a license before we get super raunchy. But know that either now or in 1 to 5 years I'll be making margaritas and that leaking. I'll be making margaritas in that liking salty sweat all the way down and grabbing a line from that pretty before you know it unimpressive assessment on my identity. But I promise you King Smith is known around the country. Nearly anyone who has touched a cassette tape is also at least a little all familiar with the view of Scuse though. Nones such a rampaging super fan as I so either I am a fellow teen in the east coast or someone who can rent a car literally anywhere as a little throwaway. Sherma Illinois is also a callback to one of his cinematic masterpieces. Bless y'all. I appreciate getting the whole family involved with the wives. Let's all get together line up and I'll take you all like a circus seal. I've also got a little secret and that I've been collecting my naughty night juices since you've started the podcast. I'll dress up like plankton and bring along the cum bucket and secret sauce and we'll party like it's Jonestown 1999. Snooze. I'm really worried because like two of them ago, Snugs was sipping over Aaron. This one they were sipping over Nicky. Does that mean I'm next, I'm both violently uncomfortable and also a little turned on kind of sins. First of all, let me, let me sincerely apologize for any miscommunication. I frequently tell all of the people that I love to go fuck themselves. Just ask John ask Nicky, fuck, ask my mom for that matter. I feel like I got more of a mention than I was gunning for here. I also agree that my analysis might have been a little off last week. Whatever. I'm sure Daphne and Velma weren't perfect solving their first mysteries either, but we have clues this week. So let's get into them really quickly. First of all. Ok, Grandmaster Poba. Huh? First, I thought that was a Jab at Aaron because Meg calls him poo bear sometimes. But I looked it up and Wikipedia tells me that that's a Gilbert and Sullivan reference from 18 85 sin also mentions having touched a cassette tape and uses the phrase by gum which I've never heard outside of a cartoon before. So I'm sticking with my initial thought that sin is old. Maybe even older than I originally thought. No offense. Are you a vampire? Anyway. Um, number two, I'm still pretty certain that Nugan doesn't know me or John on a personal level, but they definitely know Aaron because they keep coming at him. No, don't, don't talk about me. I don't, I don't, I don't exist also phrasing. Let's avoid the word coming. Mhm. Like number three. Ok. They clearly don't know how far away I am from being of legal drinking age, but they're considerate enough to want to wait until I'm legal before doing all of those things. We bleeped out. So, first of all, we've got an old slot with a heart of gold. But second of all, you're definitely not somebody that knows me because anybody that knows me knows my exact age, birth date and social security number. It's just a thing. Uh, and number four, there's a lot of spongebob in that last paragraph. Jonestown happened in 1978 but spongebob first aired in 1999 which is how Snoops wants to party. I wonder if that's a hint. Somehow I've got nothing with this, but I'm on the edge of my seat, both with Snus writing ins and Nicky's uh unconventional brand of sleuthing. Fuck off. You're doing great. Sweetie. I'm gonna find you snugs. I'm gonna get you. I'm on that ass like white on a brick that's painted white. Freezing again. Freezing, freezing again. All right, folks. If, if you think we're missing any of sin's hints or if you have some news to share, please write to us, visit our website that's rocky talky podcast dot com and fill out the contact form. Nikki could seriously use some help on the sin hunt. If you think she's overlooking something obvious, write to us and tell us, excuse me, I'm doing fine on my own. But honestly though I'll take a clue from sins. Wink, Wink or from a listener. Anybody. Really? All right. I think that brings us to everybody's favorite segment. Nicky asks a question. Yeah. So you don't have to deal with me this week. We have two write ins and I'm pretty pumped. Both of these have been on my list to ask about. So John, you pick, are we doing statues first or eggs statues? It is. Damn it. This question comes to us from Jill, which is who we spoke about previously. She runs at Rocky H P S on Instagram. Hi, Jill, Jill. Right. Hi, y'all. So I have always had this question but I have no idea if the answer is actually easy to find or if there's even an answer out there. So I just want to know the story of the statue things when Brad Janet Rocky and Columbia were frozen. They must have been real objects because I've seen a picture of Barry and his for show makeup standing with his, with Janet and Rockies in the background. So basically, my questions are, how did they make them out of? What did they model them entirely off of the actors? Where did they go after filming? Why have I never heard anyone talk about this? And am I making a fool of myself asking? Because the answer is less complex than I'm making it anyways? I love your podcast. Thanks. If you answer. Also, I'm just going to say, I have wondered this since like the first time I saw Rocky. So Jill, you're not alone. I agree with you. Maybe we're both fools. Well, both of you will be happier to know that. I know this one. I know I know something about this stupid fucking movie for one time. They are totally real. OK? So in the Rocky horror stage show before Floor Show, Brad Janet Rocky and Columbia are simply drugged by Riffraff's atomizer and let off stage. So it isn't until the movie adaptation that they become frozen, right? The decision to freeze them into statues was probably made by Richard o'brien or Jim Sharman when they were doing the adaptation. And that meant that Barry Boswick, Susan Sarandon, Little Nell and Peter Henwood all had to undergo a full body cast in Boston Massachusetts shut up. I, I really can't imagine that though. I like. Can you imagine having to stay still doing nothing while encased in goop? Plaster casting is a super uncomfortable process that takes forever and full body casting is monotonous, doing pieces individually that then are merged to form like a full scope. It's absolutely crazy. Me, Savannah and my friend Bella are doing a cosplay for Comic Con 2021. If it happens, I'm being Joel Bella is being Ellie and Savannah is being a clicker. And if you don't know the last of us, lower clicker is a zombie that is infected with the cor formulas and he's like super gross and shit. And Savannah had to make a cast for their face. They went over to our friend Hillary's house who was also an N Y C cast member and spent like five hours there putting together this cast of just their face. So I can't like let alone their entire body that must have taken so long. And also when you're doing that face thing, like it's hard to breathe, you can't move or else you're gonna fuck it up. It feels like you are being enclosed in like, oh I can't even imagine doing it for your entire body. Pat Quinn says on the blu-ray commentary that one of the statues was actually purchased by screenwriter Alan Sharp. Yeah, I had to look this up. He's the guy who wrote Rob Roy. It's this 1995 period piece with Liam Neeson where he's an 18th century Scottish clan chief. He also wrote a bunch of other TV shows and some movies. And speaking of random o'brien gives off the impression in the commentary that he really doesn't like that. They changed it to statues. He thinks that the bases that they sit on just come out of nowhere and make no sense. Ah, yes, because that's what makes rock, you make no sense. Of course. So, other than the, one of now I'm not aware where the other three went and I think that that's pretty much the consensus in the rest of the community. It's a shame. A lot of the set pieces from Rocky were actually just thrown away. They were pieces that had served their purpose and after they were done they went to a dumpster, there's even pictures of the tank basically being used as a dumpster after filming for the lab scene was completed. It's kind of sad seeing it with junk. Yeah. There's a picture with the tank from the movie against just like this, like singular brick wall piece. Uh, and there's just like a bunch of, you know, set debris in it with a bunch of, like, screens held up on the side of it. A bunch of random people just walking around with it. On one hand, it's like, oh, well, they're repurposing it. But on the other hand, it's like, why destroy such a great prop? Casts could have used that literally. But at least we know Nella is safe and sound hanging out in some weird writer's garden as she should be. We hope that helped Jill, sorry about the bad news about the statues. But we love questions like this. Thanks for writing in. This next question is super exciting and it's from our good friend, the emperor of New England who sent us the Stripe Shirt mystery two weeks back. And this time, he's got a question that I've been itching to ask about. He says hello again. That was a far more interesting answer to the Stripes question than I expected. I certainly didn't expect explaining it to talk as long as it did. There's another rumor about the movie that I've wondered about for a long time though. I fear it's probably not as exciting. The story goes that the cast had an Easter egg hunt on set during filming, but somehow missed some of the eggs and they showed up on film. The places where I've heard they can supposedly be seen include under Frank's throne and among the pineapple shaped lamps. Is this rumor at all based on fact, if so, how do I always manage to miss them? If not, is the origin of the rumor as interesting? Probably not. This is probably a dumb question but, oh, well, so was the last one, one piece of information I can provide is that the first place I read about this was in a series of books titled Uncle John's bathroom reader. Yours. The Duke of New England. Apparently. Well, thanks Duke. It sure was an exhausting journey through that striped shirt. Good thing you didn't ask about another crazy urban legend. Uh So I took a look for your bathroom reader and though I can't find the specific one with that statement, it seems reasonable that they would have published it at some point. Uncle John's bathroom reader. Not to be confused with me. Of course, has a 2014 version with a History of Rocky. It's basically like a five page spark notes of South Piros book Creature of the Night. You know, the one that we reference literally every episode every time. Uh The chapter opens up with this very suburban sentence. Imagine the boy next door trading in his Levis for Fishnet Stockings, his all American sister sporting a sexy French maids outfit. I appreciate that they made that kind of incest. Yep, dodge the bullet there. I've even heard this one and seen the photo, the one of Richard o'brien sitting on the throne where there's literally an egg sitting on the support of the bottom of the chair. The story goes that the crew had an Easter egg hunt one day and some of the eggs were left behind during filming. There's the one under the throne and I think there's some more, but I don't know where I'm glad his holiness of New England and I are on the same wavelength, Aaron, what do you say? Can you tell us where the other eggs are? And maybe something about the Easter egg hunt or why they had an Easter egg hunt in the first place? Yeah, I've got to say this seems pretty ready set go. I've seen the photo, I've heard the story. Hell, I've repeated the story a ton of times. So I hopped on, I started digging for the info all about it. I found some fantastic stuff that our Duke is gonna love. So in 1979 the photo of Riff In the Throne was published in one of the full page color inserts in the Rocky horror picture show book. That's the one by Bill Hanken. I'm pretty sure that it's a Mick rock photo. I'm not positive about that. I haven't sourced that. It looks very similar to a bunch of the other ones that we do know that he took. So after the book came out throughout the eighties and the nineties, you heard this Easter egg story repeated by word of mouth and even in some of the fan publications. So everyone would see the accompanying photo of Riff in the throne with the egg underneath him. That makes sense. The super fans all had the Henken book so someone could just bust it out at a cast party. You'd be like take a look right there, you could see the egg. Yeah. So when you get into the nineties. There's some news group posts about the egg that give us a little bit more context and some hints to what we're looking for. John, let's do one of those dramatic readings we did last week. This one's from 1993. Also concerning questions. Does anyone know the other two locations of Easter eggs in the movie? According to a rumor, the cast had an Easter egg hunt on the set and three of the eggs were forgotten about and it can be seen during the movie. One is located underneath Frank's Throne and can be seen during sweet transvestite as for the others. Well, there are two to find. I have been told that one of the eggs can be seen during the casts first ride up the elevator after sweet transvestite. If I look through the bars, I kind of see something signed Tom Servo. That's a MST three K reference, right? That's pretty funny. Yeah, I also found an article on E eggs dot com. It's like this 20 year old site that chronicles Easter eggs and popular culture. So this was posted in like 2000 Nicky. Give me this one about the Easter eggs. There's one, a lamp that's shaped like a dragon in the main hall where they dance the time warp. It's in the dragon's eye under Frank's throne. You can see it during sweet transvestite and in the elevator, you can only see it when they finished. Sweet transvestite and they're going into the lab, you can see that downward shot and it's somewhere near Brad, I think. Yeah, this lines up with the common telling that was in like the rocky horror, frequently asked questions that floated around the internet. Back in the nineties, there's a copy from the news group. This one's from like 95 it says this one day during filming, the technical crew had an Easter egg hunt on the set. Rumor has it that three eggs can be seen one under Frank's throne. One is the group ascends in the elevator. And the third is said to be where the light bulbs go on one of the gargoyles in the main room. So this is pretty promising, right? We have a consistent although it evolves, you know, kind of story about where we're supposed to find these Easter eggs. That's awesome in hunting this down. I even came across a ton of accounts that Rocky horror might even be the source of the term Easter egg. Yeah, there's a looper article that makes this claim and cites a 2009 urban dictionary book. If you're confused, you should be because it's a book that's a crossover of the self-titled website that was published like at the height of its meme potential. And the book is a direct printing of the urban dictionary website. And this entry about Easter eggs dates back to 2004. It says the term Easter egg as it relates to a hidden film. Secret originates from the 1975 movie, the Rocky Horror Picture Show when the cast had an Easter egg hunt, but most of the eggs went unfound. They can be seen throughout the film in various locations such as under Frank and Fer's Throne Urban Dictionary. And there's been a ton of other articles talking about the same thing in the decades since that urban dictionary book. There's been articles in People Magazine Huffington Post. What culture? Tons of stuff. I've seen tons of articles, social media posts, et cetera all over the place saying the same stuff. If you Google Search for Rocky Horror, plus Easter egg hunt, it gives you 228,000 results. Oh, awesome. So, Aaron, you did the thing, you went through the movie frames. Where exactly are these eggs and when exactly can we see them? So we might have a problem. Please don't do this. Listen. Ok. I looked at the gargoyle first, right? The statues in the ballroom have illuminated lights in the eye sockets, but none of them are replaced with an egg. There's a couple shots where one of the lights has sorted out and it's off and there's a few frames during sweet tea where you can vaguely see what might be a cream colored oval shape in front of one of the lights. But on closer inspection, it's just the shape of the eye socket carving like arching back into the statue's beak and it's shown at an angle and a focal length that causes it to look optically distorted. I don't think it's actually an egg though. Well, crap. Yeah, I could see how you can misconstrue that. But what about the elevator? So, the elevator is where I think we might have a problem. I'm pretty sure that there just shouldn't be any eggs in the elevator. Even if there are other ones hidden in the ballroom. I checked it anyway. And no, there's no eggs visible during the entire time that Brad Janet Riff Columbia Magenta are riding the elevator. I went through every single frame. There's some interesting stuff you see, like at the very beginning there's like glassware and statues on all the shelves. There's like some blue oval reflections and some of the lights you can even see a cable taped to the floor running to one of the pineapple lamps. Unfortunately, at no point. Are there any Easter eggs visible? Why didn't you think that they would be there? So, the ballroom in the elevator were not actually shot in the same place. The elevator was at Oakley Court and the ballroom for Time Warp was shot at Bray Studios, which was down the road from Oakley Court. Maybe they just had a really big Easter egg hunt. Mm. No, no, I've got a bad feeling about this. Yeah. The more I looked into it, the more confusing this whole thing got. So in 1996 there was a news group post that I thought could have been a lead. It sounded good and it says everyone seems to be wrong at the 50th anniversary I slash we were talking to Richard o'brien and he explained a few things in one publicity photo with riffraff in Frank's chair. You see an egg sitting on the bottom of the place where the legs meet, Richard had his son, I believe he said son might be a nephew on the set and they had an Easter egg hunt around Easter time. The egg was overlooked. I had to say it that way because overlooked was capitalized for some reason. Like it's excellent, like it was like a proper noun. I mean, I guess it could be true. Richard and his wife, Kimmy Wong were both on set at the same time and she was a Transylvanian in the film. Yeah, I realized I could check into this info and see how close the filming dates were to the Easter holiday. Right? When you make a film, there's always a shooting script. It's got like all of the scenes broken down and that's accompanied by a shooting schedule. That's got all of those same scenes, but broken down by the days they be filmed and chronologically what scenes they're gonna film when, right? Because movies always film stuff totally out of order. Exactly. So I knew a few copies of the script existed and I reached out to the community to see if anybody had a good copy of the shooting schedule through good fortune. We actually have access to pretty much the definitive version of this schedule. All of this information that I'm gonna be talking about comes from Rocky horror legend Larry Weisel and his collection of documents from Michael White, the producer on the film, he generously shared the entire filming schedule and this thing's dated September 24th, 1974. So that's about a month before filming started in order to determine exactly which scenes were scheduled for shooting. We were able to cross reference the shooting script that's hosted on rocky music dot org and that script dates from around July to October of 74. So combining these two things together, we can see exactly what was filmed when they filmed it and which shots not just scenes, but which specific shots were filmed where running through. This is actually kind of fascinating in itself. The movie starts filming in late October. They first film all of the scenes that are at the church and then they move over to film all of lab scene on October 25th. The lab was filmed on the larger of the two sound stages at Bray Studios just down the street from Oakley Court. Filming of lab scene ends on November 7th and then they go shoot the scene at Oakley all the way through mid November after labs done. They clear the entire sound stage and they have to move the elevator out of the water tank that would eventually become the pool and move it over to Oakley Court. We know that this was moved by November 14th because that's when they shot the scenes in the castle corridors for like planet S and all of the other stuff. Oh, wow. They moved the elevator. It was in the pool under the floor when they were filming the lab. Yeah, that's pretty crazy. Right. They couldn't even get in the elevator when it comes up for lab scene. They had to get into it, get lowered down into the water tank and then wait to get raised up during the scene. That sounds claustrophobic as shit to be fair. Most of the process of this movie has so far seriously. So I went through this whole shooting schedule trying to pin down the dates for this Easter egg hunt on November 20th at Oakley Court. They filmed the beginning of sweet tea. The part that's at the elevator and the end of sweet tea. That's got all of Frank's pickups, that's his antica patient stuff and all of that. They also filmed all of the actual elevator scenes which would include the one where supposedly you can see an egg if there is an egg to be seen during an elevator. After they filmed on the 20th. They had a night shoot on the 21st they rested for a day on the 22nd. And then they had a dress rehearsal for time Warp on the 23rd because the set that was the lab scene had been fully flipped over into the ballroom by the 25th. So they filmed time Warp on the 25th, the 26th and the 27th. And that's the window where we know that there's an egg visible underneath the throne. The ballroom was cleared and flipped for floor show on the 28th and they filmed floor show on the 28th through the sixth. This is kind of a problem because it actually means that there would have to be two completely separate Easter egg hunts for the elevator story to be true at all. The first Easter egg hunt would have had to have occurred at Oakley Court on November 20th and that's how there would be an egg visible outside the elevator. And the second Easter egg hunt would have had to have occurred sometime between November 7th and November 27th at Bray Studios on the ballroom set. And that's the only way that Mick Rock could have taken that photo of riff with the egg. We can kind of speculate that if the egg hunt happened, it was probably closer to the 20th and the 25th as the ballroom was under constructed the entire time before that. And the newly constructed set was probably not fully dressed until later in the shooting schedule. So for the remains of an Easter egg hunt to exist through filming, one would assume that it wasn't sitting there on set for very long. But hold on, all of that was in October, November and December of 1974. Why was there even an Easter egg hunt in winter? That doesn't make any sense. Well, fuck. Is this another urban legend? Well, we have the picture of the egg, the one with Riff on the throne. So here's the thing, I think we might even have a problem with that. No way. The only place you can actually see the throne from the correct angle in the film is as Frank walks towards the throne at the start of sweet tea for like 70 frames, you can also see it at the very end of time warp. When the Transylvanian's fall down on the stairs, there's like this knobby shape at the top of the stretcher on the bottom of the throne. However, both of these occurrences are less clear than the shot of Riff. And that makes it pretty much unnecessary to use the film as a reference since there's absolutely no question as to the authenticity of the photo of Riff on the throne. The Mick Rock book has a few photos of the throne, but the stretcher is almost always obscured or like not visible. I guess that all seemed to line up, but then something came up to auction in 2010 and kind of threw all of these assumptions into question. Well, shit. Yeah. So in 2010, a throne was put up for auction that is almost identical to the throne that's used in the film. There were eight pictures posted with this auction. It has the same shape, the same points at the top, the same upholstery layout. Yeah. Even the stupid little che are done in the exact same style and shape. It says it's carved out of Walnut and it's like super obvious. This is a near twin to the one in the movie. There's minor differences but they aren't significant. Yeah. And it's one of those photos where we start to see a problem because one of them shows the lower stretcher on the chair and there's a knobby bit on it that looks kind of similar to the egg in the movie. Oh No. Uh OK. Yeah, I see it here. It's not quite as round, it's more like octagonal, but that's obviously a feature of the throne carved into the stretcher. Yeah, this, this really makes you pause right. When I saw these photos, I immediately went back to the photo of Riff to take a closer look. I pulled out my copy of the Hanken book where it was first published and then I realized that the photo that was in the Hanken book was actually flipped horizontally. Wait, really? We've been looking at a flipped photo. Oh Shit. Respect is on the wrong foot. He wears it on his right. The Henkin book photo is flipped so it looks like it's on his left. Has it always been published flipped? No, the Henken books, the only source that I know has it flipped when it got republished in the Rocky World Treasury. It, it was flipped the correct orientation, but that was the only version almost anyone saw for a good 10, 15 years. Right. Yeah, you can see yet another place where we might have a problem like looking back at the un flipped version. It started to occur to me that this could just be like a spherical decorative knobby bit, not an egg. It might only look like an egg because of a trick of the lighting. When the image is flipped correctly, the shadows that give it this egg shape become a lot less pronounced and you can kind of see that they could be created by the lights. Oh man, I totally see it. Shit. Ok. Now that I've looked at these auction pictures, this is definitely a matching throne and now even I'm skeptical. Yeah, there's also what appears to be wood grain in the egg that matches the wood grain of the walnut used on the rest of the throne stretcher that could be paint texture or something, but it's super suspicious. So where does that leave us then? Is this just an urban legend? I mean, it's starting to sound a lot like an urban legend. The story was first that the crew did an Easter egg hunt. Then years later that they did it egg hunt for Richard's kid, for Easter. Then there were specific places you could see the eggs and then it went so far as to be rumored that rocky is the source of the term Easter egg entirely. And on top of that, the movie wasn't even filmed during Easter. And even if they did hold an Easter egg hunt in the middle of winter, it's extremely unlikely that they held two separate hunts a week apart for the eggs to appear miles apart from each other. And then the only source that we do have gets undermined by some auction photos. This one's not looking good. So Larry did mention one other possibility. He recalled hearing from Rocky horror legend Jean Chiari, that Brian Thompson, he was the set designer for the stage show and the movie, right. Jean said that Brian had told him that the egg under the throne was there as a nod to Fabri eggs. And if you don't know, those are the crazy gold and jeweled eggs from Russia from the late 19th and early 20th century, they're like these blinged out pieces of crazy. Yeah. So the theory there is Frank knew that royalty kept eggs, but as with a lot of things around the castle, he didn't quite understand human culture. So Jean says that Brian mentioned he had put a rotten egg under there. No way they were filming there for a week if it was rotten. Yeah, I'm super skeptical of that, especially because of the throne photos from the auction house. So I guess we can't confirm the existence of the Easter eggs. In fact, all of the evidence points to it being untrue. The story has all the hallmarks of an urban legend. It evolved over time, it shifted its claims and eventually bit off way more than it could chew saying that Rocky was the origin of the entire term Easter eggs and pop culture. Yeah. And the statues in the elevator where eggs are supposedly visible are not true. At least within the context of the film footage, the one shown under the throne is most likely a knobby decorative piece on the leg stretcher and just looks remarkably like an egg due to the lighting. I mean, this was exacerbated by the first printing of the photo being flipped horizontally in the Hanken book. And even if it was an egg, it's probably intentional set dressing to emulate a fab egg. Not from some mythical Easter egg hunt. I sympathize with the decorative piece on the leg because I also look remarkably like an egg shape due to the lighting. And as for Rocky being the origin of the term Easter egg, we know that that 1 100% is not true. The real origin of the phrase Easter egg is actually really well documented on Wikipedia with site of reliable sources, of course. So in 1979 Steve Wright, the then director software development in the Atari consumer division used the term Easter egg hunt to describe a hidden message in the Atari video game adventure. So this one isn't looking great. I'm pretty confident that the whole Easter egg hunt thing is an urban legend. I'm somewhere around 80% sure that it's just like a knobby bit. That's part of the throne though. There's a good 15% possibility that it's actually an intentional piece of set dressing a Fabri egg or something. Ok. Bear with me here. I can't math, but I'm certain that's not 100%. Well, Larry did send me one other thing. It's a picture and I'm gonna toss it in the dock here real quickly so you guys can take a look. So it's a picture of Columbia and she's looking super fucking cute. And she's standing next to one of those castle gargoyles and it has a shield with the Transylvanian flag lightning bolt on it. But guys, she's holding an egg. Is this real? She's in her time warp stuff. She's got the, the giant bow tie on the, the top hat, the gold sequin tail coat and in her left hand, she's just holding up this white egg. I mean, it's clearly an egg. There's no question about it. This is an egg. I don't even know. There's like a million reasons. Someone might have had the shadow behind that egg does not look in any way, shape or form or relevant to the egg. This picture is way too clear. This has got to be shopped. I'm skeptical about this being a legitimate thing. I don't think that this is like an Easter egg. I think this is like Nell's breakfast. But yeah, we will definitely be posting this photo on all of our social media stuff so you guys can look at it too and, and, and figure out if, wow, if this is actually something that uh gives the legend some credence, yeah, we're absolutely going to have to put all of this info up into our show notes and all of these pictures are going to go up on all of our social media accounts, Facebook, Instagram, tiktok, all at Rocky Talkie Podcast. So everybody out there take a look and tell us what you think this one was supposed to be easy, but I guess we just can't catch a break. So, since you're in New England, you tell us, was that as exciting as the stripe shirt? So that's it for today, everybody. But before we go, we just wanna thank everyone who wrote into us this week, Jill the archdiocese of New England, our best friend, sins and Rowan Rowan. We didn't forget about you, buddy. We got your message and we'll be using it as our Nicky asked the question saying segment next week. It's a really fun question. We want to make sure we devote enough time to it. We're gonna get there next week. So if you are enjoying the show and you want to help us spread the word about it, please take a moment to rate review and subscribe on itunes. It helps make our show more visible to new listeners, which is, you know, the goal of a podcast. And also we are on Facebook, Instagram and tiktok, all at Rocky Talkie podcast. So please go check us out if you like us and you want more content. Right now. We are participating in R H P S at Hoboken's 25 days of Rocky Horror Challenge, which is a lot of fun. If you're doing that too, please tag us so we can see your posts and please write to us. We love getting message submissions from you guys. It literally makes our entire day. We want to hear about all the cool Rocky stuff you and your cast are working on and we want to share it on our show. If you're working on a rocky related project you're excited about or if your cast is doing a show and you want to spread the word. Go to our website rocky talky podcast dot com and fill out our contact form to share with us last but not least we want to wish all of our listeners a very happy and safe holiday we hope you get a lot of really good presents and get to spend time hanging out with people you love. If you're seeing other people, please be safe. We want to give you all a big kiss on the mouth at R K 04, which we can only do if you don't get got by 2020. So mask up and tell Santa to leave your presence on the roof instead of coming all the way into your house, socially distance, you know the drill. But I thought that Doctor Fauci vaccinated Santa, well, we'll see you guys next Thursday. Bye. Yeah. Fuck you sins. No, no. And just a reminder to all of our listeners, I'm going to sneeze again. Don't do it. That's the reminder. Just a reminder I'm gonna sneeze. Have a good night and just a reminder to all of our listeners. Cob web. Fuck. You don't look at me like you don't just a reminder to all of our listeners. Cobweb. Fuck you. Rocky thought he's back. I do not have to sneeze because I chose to stop sneezing. Ok. Fuck. What does the scent mean? I was gonna say, do I make a noise or do I say a scent? Uh Yeah, well, that's it. Just, well, OK, good night. Why the fuck was I not invited? You? You can be a bloater. Nicky. Ok? I will, I'm putting it together now. What do I want to do? What kind of voice? Do I want to do? Uh also concerning questions? Fuck I get. All right. Yeah. So it's like a picture of Colombia looking fine as hell. Honestly, I love it. And she's with like the gargoyle and he has a plaque that has, is that the Transylvanian lightning bowl or is that just like a? OK. Is this real? Am I missing something essential to this photo? Oh, she's holding an egg. Oh Hey. Oh my God. Ok. Let's do that again because Jesus, I didn't even see the egg. The shadowing. Ok. Bye. I quit the show.