Hello to all you unconventional conventions. Welcome to Rocky Talkie. I'm Jacob. I'm John and I'm Aaron today. I'm subbing in for Nicky who has gone on part two of her ocean expedition with James Cameron. Still searching for the heart of the ocean. Will they find it or will it be forever claimed by the sea tune in next week to find out they both could have fit on that door. We all watched Mythbusters John. We know they could have both fit on that door. I'm gonna fit in your door. Wow. And what, what were you doing this week while you were trying to get in my door? Y'all know what I was doing. I just came back from fucking Disney World Disneyland. Yeah, I was down in Orlando for the past week or so because I think it was a little bit longer than a week celebrating actually, somebody from the Rocky Horror community got married. Oh, congrats. Congratulations to Randa and Tyler. Yeah. Ah Yeah. So Randa and Tyler are both on the full body cast. They also probably performed with Tess Rat and R K O because all of them, but fuck each other. On a regular basis, but Randa and Tyler are now married. So, congratulations to the two of you. It was a fantastic wedding. I got to see a lot of really cool Rocky people that I haven't seen in a while myself in Savannah along with uh Zephyr and Harley of R K O. We went to Disney, we went to all the parks, we went to Universal, we went to the wedding. It was a fantastic week off and I'm still feeling it. My body still hurts and I've been home for almost a week at this point. Oh my God, congratulations guys, Tyler reopen your Etsy shop. I need more patches. Yeah, you heard it here, bitch. Seriously. What about you, Aaron, what happened this past week while I was gone? Not much work has been crazy for me this week, but I did get a chance just this last weekend uh for the Diablo Two Resurrected Open Beta that happened. Uh So my good friend Marty and I got on and played through the uh couple of acts that were there as flashbacks to my childhood uh and more like high school, but it was so much fun. Uh I had a blast playing through that. We were up for, I don't know, five hours on Discord just chatting it up while we were slaying monsters. And uh it was a lot of fun. It was a good flashback, good break from the rest of my hectic ass week with all of the, all the work stuff that I've been dealing with. So that was a lot isn't Diablo uh, by Activision Blizzard. You know, we don't, we, we, we're able to separate the art, the art. Um, and even though everyone who works there is a huge piece of shit. I assume that this was outsourced to some Chinese company. So I don't, I don't hate those shit. I do hate those people too. Um No, not those people. I, I still play Overwatch every night. Oh, all right. See. All right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Pot. Get All black. We get it. All right. Jacob. How was your week? Uh My week's been great. I have probably been doing the most rocky, like, disgustingly rocky related thing uh this past week because I've been reading one of those books. Uh Confessions of a Transylvanian and I am enjoying it. If you are a rocky person and you miss the gossipy nature of Rocky culture read this book because I feel like I'm getting tea and I enjoy it. Tea is delicious. Hell, yeah, dude. I'm glad you finally are getting to that. Yeah. I'm pretty deep in it. I'm, I'm enjoying myself. It's a good one. It's a good one. After you read that one. I've got the other one for you. Uh It is not as good. The other one is really bad by comparison. I am like halfway through it and I cannot continue. But confessions of a Transylvanian Kevin Theseus. Oh, so good, so good. I love both of you. You will never ever catch me reading a fucking rocky horror book. I would never catch me reading a book. Period. Let alone something about Rocky John. We know you can't read. You don't need to pretend like it's just Rocky stuff. Facts. Oh Right. And with that, let's get started with our first segment. So this week in Global News, the orchard theater in Dartford United Kingdom picked a whole bunch of oopsie daisies, oopsy Daisy. So in preparation of the UK 2021 tour, the theater staff claimed to have placed an order for curly black frankfurter wakes to sell to audience members. However, someone's lines seem to have gotten crossed somewhere as the confused staff ended up with a box of 52 cans of frankfurter sausages and a grand total of 416 individual sausages. Did, did somebody get him out and count? I hope so. I wish that that were my job. So theater employee Kay Haley spoke with Kent online about the amusing mix up stating I opened the box and I was completely confused. We checked to make sure no one in the venue had ordered them and we couldn't believe the mistake. We are still checking to see what happened. Can I um recommend Kay that you might want to check with your marketing people? I bet they have an idea what happened. Anyway, the theater staff were able to laugh at themselves, even posting videos and Tik Toks online of staff members looking into boxes and trying to reason through the mistake. In the end, they very generously donated the tins of sausage to food banks in Dartford. They should have saved them and sold them to audience members who wanted to do the hardcore A P you know, where you eat hot dogs at Frank. I long to be part of a show where that happens. Oh, gross. And can you imagine on actual theater seats like in an actual theater? That's so messy. No slimy wet sensation on your face as it comes flying through the theater. Yum The Rocky Horror Tour will be making its way to the orchard theater on Tuesday, August 31st. If you're one of our UK listeners and you would like more info on the tickets. We've got them linked for you in our show notes. And next up for those of you who may not be aware, Sydney Australia went back into lockdown on June 27th, 2021 in an attempt to curb the rising number of COVID outbreaks. Nell Campbell. Sydney's Resident Disco Ball is of course well known for being very interactive with her fans, especially members of the Rocky community in past episodes. We've talked about her new cameo account and how much she seems to be enjoying goofing off with her fans throughout these videos since the start of the second lockdown. Nell has been interacting with her fans really heavily through Instagram. Like lots of us when we went to mark time combat boredom and dick around on social media all in one go. She started doing one post a day. Nothing crazy. Just posting about what she had done that day were funny pictures that she found online. And this very quickly morphed into a trip down memory lane for Nell when she found an old newspaper clipping featuring a photo of her with the caption little Nell strips for jailbirds with an accompanying story about how the actress had shocked England by stripping naked inside of a prison during a Christmas concert and going on to Grabe how the prison guards had no warning that this woman was going to take off her clothes. That is fucking awesome. Good for her and good for those prisoners. Um But fun fact, the article also mentions that Nell was selected to represent Australia as a swimmer in the 1972 Olympics before she was fired for having a relationship with certain members of the men's team. I had no idea she was an Olympian. Damn. Oh, for fuck's sake. Good for her though. Way to sled shame Australia. So now unearthed this article and posted it to her Instagram with the following caption day four of city lockdown sorting through my clippings archives when this caught my eye. London date approximately December 1982. One. Yes, I did perform a strip tease at Holloway Prison. After all, it was a Christmas concert. Two. No, I wasn't naked but kept on my bra knickers, gotter belt and stockings. Three. Yes, I was already booked to appear at Wandsworth Prison the next day. Authorities telephoned me to insist I not strip for their male prisoners. Four. Yes, I did. As I was told by instead arriving on stage in only bra knickers garter belt stockings and slowly put my clothes on. As I sang as Mr Dougal describes at the end of this article, although I only did this for the incarcerated, not a party trick and certainly not a gimmick. I wouldn't know the meaning of the word five. No, I was not selected to appear with the Australian swimming team at the 1972 Munich Olympics. Hence regrettably, no shenanigans with the male team. Six. Any more questions? Please contact my lawyer in writing. Thank you. Hashtag Don't tell me what to do. Oh, so she wasn't an Olympian. You could have been Nell, don't let anyone ever tell you otherwise. Oh, thank God. She corrected that one. Like I'm so sick of seeing that rumor floating around. It's not even hard to verify anyway. So this is only the tip of the iceberg after this post. Nell began regularly adding old photos and newspaper clippings to her Instagram and including lots of really amusing retrospective commentary in the captions. There's another good one with a headline that reads more trash and starts off. Speaking of trash, Little Nell of the Rocky horror picture show, hands down the greatest trash ever made without an ounce of pretense in its disreputable soul. Writes to us to announce mercifully. I have grown three inches and I am now knownn as Nell Campbell. This was an article to promote one of her cabaret acts called Snafu. Nell Campbell was absolutely an Olympic swimmer and it's 100% a government conspiracy to defame her and make us believe she wasn't. I just had to get that out there. But in the comments of this post, Nell gives us this fun little insight. Day five of Sydney lockdown. Another day another clipping the date approximately 1980. No, this is neither the first nor the last time I have been referred to as trash. One memorable night in N Y C during the late eighties shrieking with laughter with at Margaret Fink film in the back of a yellow cab whizzing from up to downtown en route to my favorite restaurant at the odeon in N Y C. The driver turned and screamed at us to pipe down as our laughter was too goddamn loud. I tried reasoning with him over the accusation but under the unforgiving gaze of Times Square's neon lighting, he swerved to the curb and hollered at me. Get out of my cab. You two bit piece of tinsel trash. I have cherished this moniker ever since as time goes on and the Sydney lockdown gets extended. However, Nell seems to get bored posting just articles and just this past week has decided to share some very saucy old photos with us. That quite frankly, I'm surprised that the Instagram algorithm allowed. Yeah. You remember when you called her the Nip slip that makes your heart dip, dude. She ponied up for you hard. Oh man. Wait, let me see. Oh boy, she's got both of us macaroni out in these pictures, guys. It's a fucking incredible boobies over here and boobies over there. Um In one of them, she is looking at the camera and like has her hand in her hair and is sort of playing with her hair and is looking like angrily at us like she's a, she's a naughty girl and she's done naughty things. And there's another where there's this like man sort of tousling her breast and she's also with another woman and they're all looking at the camera like the cameraman owes them something. It's all very playful and childish. I, I feel like I'm back in my teens and there's another where she's wearing a T shirt that has a picture of boobies on the shirt. So it's like she's naked but not naked. That is art and irony. We think it's funny. Well, if you don't want to take Jacob's word for it, there are of course some great stories in the captions about who everyone is and why the photos were taken. Uh We won't read them all on air because, well, I don't want to spoil it for you. But also we just highly encourage all of our listeners to go check these out. Wait, so this is what passes for news these days. Oh my God. News flash. Everyone. The sky is blue. The earth is round and no likes to show her boobies. Yeah, I mean fair. But this is more of a public service announcement. Noah has been getting very nostalgic on her social media and has been posting lots of very funny stories that I know a bunch of people in our community will probably love to hear also, you know, boo goddamn it boobies. Boobies. Oh, boobies. Yeah. Now you're getting the boobies and speaking of boobies, I think it's time that we moved on to our next segment. Community news come unity news and, oh boy, are there a lot of boobies in this one? So many boobies. I sat entranced for nearly an hour and a half at all. The boobies I got to see for those of you who might be wondering why did Jacob sit for an hour and a half for boobies? I don't think any of us are wondering that. But go on a little under a month ago, a group of theater artists both studying and recently graduated from L I U Long Island University teamed up to create their very own fan movie, a Rocky tribute film. If you will. Now, before we get into the details of the movie and talk about all the cool stuff we saw, I've got to first just commend them. Everyone involved in the creative process of this film were theater students and it wasn't for grades or graduation that they made this film. They just did it because they loved Rocky and wanted to interact with it in a way that was unique and meaningful to them. Taking on a huge project like making a full length indie film while you're also trying to finish school. Sounds like an absolute bitch of a time mad props to all of them for being able to juggle all that and make something that ended up so damn cool. And did we mention it's a full length hour and a half movie yet? This was no small feat. They did a great job and honestly, we had a blast getting to watch it. All right, I'll write enough dick sucking. Let's hear about it. Ok. So after the lips and the opening credits, the movie shifts to black and white wedding scene. Damn it, Janet. And there's a light all stay true to the O G. But things get fun as they approach the castle. The set for the castle looks like an abandoned maze in the woods with lots of big concrete slabs covered in graffiti, some of its set piece, graffiti like the words Transylvanian connection, but most of its graffiti, graffiti giving the whole movie a rundown skater park kind of vibe. And though we change sets and design pretty soon this cool kid vibe stays with us through the movie as you're never more than a few minutes away from someone smoking a blunt. And additionally, the Transylvanian's who are very visible throughout the entire film take the place of the those kids whose parties you always wanted to be invited to but never. Were they very radically in dress? But all of them look popping like we saw leather jackets, chains dresses, some with a lot of makeup, some with none and one in adorable hard shaped classes. Love those as Riff and Magenta begin time warp. The screen jumps out with color and you really start to appreciate the the craziness of the set and the costumes. Uh The real fun though is at Frank's entrance. So the beginning of Sweet Tea is like this Dracula homage. Frank starts his opening number while literally hanging upside down wrapped in his dark black cape in line with the rundown vibe. Frank's throne is a milk crate but the image they present of Riff Mags and Columbia all behind Frank is spot on one of my favorite moments in the movie comes just after sweet tea. When in place of the elevator ride, Brad and Janet walk down a staircase and on one step, they start in that seemingly abandoned rundown area of concrete and trees. But they step down and are transported into this tiny room of the future and fancy. A lot of streamers and bright colors turn the old vibe of the movie on its head and makes me think that we're like setting foot into someone's idealized dreamland where before it was down in dingy now it's new and cool and colored in the bright neon of industrial lighting, not the rainbow graffiti of motley street art. But don't worry, we still have the same cast of weed smoking decked out Transylvanian's traing. This area, this becomes the setting for pretty much everything throughout the rest of the film. And this new area is also similar to where we see. Crim. Crim feels more like a real detective out of fun cargo or anything else on like HBO. He's resigned to a poorly lit room but the wall he sits in front of is covered in pictures pinched onto a little clothes line as though he's like an on the ground detective hastily working on the case. So something I noticed around this point is that they're following along with the stage show more closely than they are with the movie, which makes sense for a group of theater kids, but also feels kind of ironic since they're making it into a movie. A lot of the tiny events were sequenced as they are in the stage show like once in a while is right after Brad and Rocky have their bedroom scene. Not after Janet runs into the lab and spies Brad on the transducer. It, it was cool. It, it felt like they kind of wanted to blend both pieces into one and there were parts where it definitely worked. I absolutely loved the beginning of the dinner scene. They go into this low angle shot, going down the table, looking up at everyone's faces, you sort of get reintroduced to everyone as they sit down to dinner, which I thought was inventive and very creepy. And I also felt that the soundtrack did a lot to capture that like moderate element of horror in Rocky, like that was true throughout the movie, but especially in this one bit. So props to the soundtrack guy for creeping me the fuck out. One thing I really appreciated was that, well, this was obviously a film made in complete earnest. They don't take it all too seriously. Sometimes they bend the limits of the original to try something new, but other times they just have fun with it and overemphasize facials expressions to give the movie that Campy Rocky horror feel a perfect example is roll call where every call out is hilariously intense in the same vein during dinner scene, everyone is adequately shocked to find out they're eating Eddie except Brad who could not give two shits and just keeps eating easily. The highlight of my laughs. I'm gonna have to disagree with you though, Jacob, the best left for me was undoubtedly when Riff produces a straight up gun to kill Frank. But of course, later on, Doctor Scott has the line, it's a laser and the camera pans to what is 100% a handgun. The irony. Fucking fantastic. So, my favorite part was absolutely Frank's. I'm going home because in the original, we have Frank just regularly sings his song on the same stage after Riff Raff and Magenta approach him and are like, hey, we're gonna kill you. They sort of just like, let him have his song. And it always felt a little weird to me because it's like, why are you letting him have a finale just like, like kill him like you guys don't care. But in this, in this remake and whatever they're doing here, it's like Frank has like uh a dream sequence that he goes into the screen. Blacks out for a little bit and reappears with Frank alone in like an empty swimming hall with an empty swimming pool in a very, very white room and he has his whole song there and when he's done it blacks out again and we are returned right to where we left off with Riffa Magenta about to kill Frank. And I thought that was nice. It made a lot more sense to me. Uh What about you guys? Did you John or Aaron have a favorite part or anything you really wanted to mention I enjoyed sitting through this seeing something different, you know, that, that people have done with Rocky, I mean, as like with any kind of independent film or student film or whatever, you know, there's gonna be parts that hit, there's gonna be parts that Miss, I think on a, on a whole more parts of this hit than Miss. It was really well done. I enjoyed the different characterizations that they chose. I enjoyed the makeup choices that they make. Frank's uh four show makeup was fantastic. That looked great. There were a lot of homages to the stage show, really appreciated that I liked the uh black and white opening. That was super cool to like get that thrown back in. I just, I, I was into it. I, I, I enjoyed the choices they were making. It was fun to see people having fun with Rocky. You know, honestly, my favorite part of the movie was probably the pacing like O G Rocky is paced so fucking weirdly and all the changes they made to this film fixed it beautifully. Both films were almost exactly the same length, but this movie sped up the parts that dragged and spent a little extra time on the interesting parts that like we all want to see more of and getting to watch through this movie after being so familiar with Rocky was a lot of fun. Everything felt like it was moving so fast and it definitely seemed as though the film expected you to be familiar with the O G movie. So you can understand what's happening even as the movie rolls by, you could totally tell that this was made by Super Rocky fans for Super Rocky fans. They made a lot of big choices that modernized elements of the movie while keeping a lot of it true to the original. Yeah. And we wish this group all the best in their future work and congratulate them on this massive massive endeavor that turned out to be a really cool ass movie. Uh If you'd like to check it out, they're at some insects called the Human Race. All one word on tiktok and Instagram, shoot them ad M on either platform and they will hook you up with a link to the movie next up. You guys know how much we love showcasing fanmade projects on this show. And we're very excited to get to chat about two back to back. You wouldn't believe it is a small indie shop based in London. It's run by a gentleman named Mike. The shop creates handmade wooden artwork, including original custom designs. Mike discovered his artistic side a bit later on in life than most. He recalls being OK at drawing at school but was never really much of a creative until as recently as 2019 when he was diagnosed with adult A DH D. It was like a light bulb moment for me. Said Mike uh getting diagnosed and being told that once I start treatment I can do anything. I have no idea why I went down the path I did that brought me to starting my own business. But I'm thankful to my A DH D for bringing me here since discovering his artistic side. Mike has turned to sixties, seventies, eighties and nineties pop culture, especially films and TV. S that he enjoyed in his youth for creative inspiration for his pieces. And this brings us to why we're chatting about Mike today. He's recently added a very cool Rocky horror piece to his shop. The piece is a 3d design featuring Franken Furter seated in a giant pair of lips with the film's logo. In the words don't dream it be, it embossed underneath. Mike was originally commissioned to make this bespoke Rocky horror piece by a private buyer and ended up loving the design so much that he decided to make more of them. He says that he wanted the piece to actually appear as though Frank is sitting on a pair of lips. Mike was able to achieve the look by using various widths of wood to create a textured layered effect, even using pieces of toothpicks to give Frank a tiny little cigarette that he's holding. The piece is absolutely beautiful and at only £75 would make a great and reasonably priced gift for the Rocky Horror fan in your life. Mike also has a variety of other pop culture pieces up for sale in his shop, including art featuring Wicked, the musical Elvis, Friends and Friday the 13th. If you're more discerning and want something extra special or custom, you're also welcome to get in touch with Mike who promises he'll do his very best to bring your three dimensional wooden art fantasies to life. And if you'd like to check out the Rocky horror picture show piece or any of the other art that's up for sale, you can visit. You wouldn't believe it. Like wooden, like W 00 D E N get it dot com. And of course, we'll have that address, link for you in our show notes. Last up in community news a side, we had a whole segment of this podcast that was going to be dedicated to telling our listeners about our sort of triumphant return to the stage. Well, the drive in theater stage anyway, but in local news, we have more on the approach of hurricane Ru Paul which is working his or her way up the coast. Let's go live to Ollie Williams with the Black You Weather report, Ollie. It's raining sideways. Sounds rough. Ollie. Do you have an umbrella? Had one? Where is it inside out? Two miles away? Is there anything we can do for you? Bring me some soup? What kind? All right, we'll get on that. Yeah, it rained. So instead we'll tell you all the tale of how this stupid hurricane already didn't even buy us dinner before he fucked us. Well, well, Jacob goes and has that cigarette from getting fucked that hard. Uh Yeah, this was, this was shaping up to be a great show. Um And then it didn't. So John John, tell me this all went well up until the day of right, not even up until the day of up until the hour of honestly. So as everyone knows, can we even call it a hurricane? It was a weak ass hurricane. Hurricane in quotations was hitting New York and parts of New England over the weekend and the rain was not supposed to start until around 10, 30 11 o'clock that evening in the Brooklyn area and we had been watching it. We have been making sure that we were still gonna be able to perform and it seemed to be fine. Like I'd confirmed with the drive in 1000 times. I checked the weather every 10 seconds because I knew it was happening. All the cast members were asking myself and meg what are we going to do if it rains? What happens if it rains? And I was just like, make sure that all of your belongings are in your suitcase and that your suitcase is waterproof, bring an umbrella and incorporate it into your show because we're still gonna do it rain or shine. We didn't have a car, which is what we usually use to kind of change. Behind. So Meg Aaron and one of our cast members, Marty brought paper screens that we can use as partitions to hide behind to do quick changes. And it was still slated like I live in Washington Heights and the place is in Brooklyn. So I left about an hour and a half before I needed to be there. And it was still gonna rain at 10 30 11 o'clock and the show started at 8 15. So we would have been done early. But of course, as soon as I get off the G train with my roommate, Adam, I checked the weather and every single weather outlet went. Remember when I said that it was supposed to start raining at 10 30. No, it's gonna start raining in 10 minutes and we were all like shit. Well, if it's just a little bit rain, whatever. So we all get there, all of us did our makeup in the rain. We were like sculpt underneath umbrellas. We would have like our little mirrors and all of our makeup underneath an umbrella. We would do our makeup and everyone looked fantastic and we had just enough time for everyone to get into full fucking makeup before the rain got so bad that we had to call it. So like the screens wouldn't stay up, the wind was bad and I want to be very transparent. The only reason that the wind was bad was because we're literally right on the East River. So obviously, we get the river breeze coming in with the fact that, you know, there's a hurricane hitting us. So like they wouldn't stay up. So we had nothing to change behind. And like, honestly, we were all kind of ready to perform in the rain. Like we were there, our stuff was on. All we needed to do was just have somebody hold an umbrella for us while we got into our individual costumes. And we would have been fine. The problem that showed ultimately was that the people who were working in the projection booth couldn't run extension cords for us to set up our lights. Which fair. Yeah. Right. Extremely fair. So they were like, uh we probably shouldn't do it. They were like, it would be fine if, if it's just raining. But because there is like lightning happening over in Manhattan, we feel kind of weird doing that here. And I was like, well, if they can't see us, there's no point in us performing. So I got on the microphone that they had inside the projector booth and I was like, hi, everyone, you can stay for the movie, please stay for the movie, but we're not performing. And there was not a single person that was like, oh, because I think they all expected it at that point because it was down pouring. And honestly, I want to reiterate we would have totally done it in the rain. But because they couldn't light us. There was no reason to keep going with it. So instead we all went to a wine bar that was around the corner and we rocketed it up there. It was fun. Honestly, like, even though it was a total wash, uh, get it wash, it was still nice to hang out with the cast. You know, we haven't really been able to do that in forever. So it was a big, oh, well, I actually got a text from the event manager today and she asked me how the show went with the rain because she wasn't in the, she wasn't in the state and her phone was off. So I had to tell her that we weren't able to perform and she said, oh, no, I'm so sorry to hear that. I'm so sorry that I wasn't able to get in touch with. You. Don't worry about it. We'll probably be showing it again soon anyway. And when we do, we'll be contacting you. So, no harm, no foul. The only thing that I was upset about is I really want to do rocky in the rain. Right. But not rocky in a hurricane. Yeah, that, that's a fine line. Like how much rain is? Too much rain and, like, how, how much of your costume do you go? All right. That stays in, that stays in the suitcase. So I'm not gonna, I'm glad I didn't have to make that call. Otherwise I'd probably have a very waterlogged Eddie jacket and, you know, God knows how my Doctor Scott stuff would have managed in that. But I don't know. It, it was still fun. It was awesome to get to see people. That was super fun. It was great to get to see people. I was super pumped when I showed up and like, everybody's getting ready and like, ok, the rain's just drizzling a little bit, but that's fine. We're, we're just gonna, we're just gonna stick it out and we're gonna do it. And no, it, it became real apparent real fast that that just was not gonna happen. Um But you know, it is what it is like, it was a major bummer for everyone. But like I gotta say it was the best to get to see people that I haven't got to hang out with like, since the beginning of the pen sexual pennsylvania. Like, it's been almost two years at this point since I've seen some of these people. Yeah. And honestly, it was kind of fun to see that there are parts of rocky that don't change like the weather was so fucking bad. And until we found out definitively that we would not be able to physically run the lights. Everyone there was still 1000% ready to perform in the pouring rain and just make it work. Were we miserable? Yes. But we still 100% would have done it. And that's literally the most rocky thing that I can think of. And it was really good to know that even though it's been close to two years at this point, our whole cast was still ready to do whatever they needed to do to put on a good show. And at the end of the day, that's what this is all about. And it was really awesome to see that. We were all still here for it. Hey, guys, you know what might make us feel better? What Jacob? Uh A Jack and Sash, you guys, you guys wanna perk up with a little Jack and Sash. Not really too fucking bad. We all know what that sound means. It's time for everyone's favorite. Nicky and Jason flavored segment J A A Q Jack Jacob asked a question or as I believe our more Deviant listeners might call it Jacking it with Jacob. It's me. I call it that I'm the Deviant listener. Me, Jacob. So come jacket. I hated all of that. Yeah, that was, that was, I mean, it's certainly a, that was dedication. That is, that is, that is something. And in today's homage to masturbatory titillation, we're gonna be talking about one of the most personally indulgent, self congratulatory and namely irrelevant of human endeavors, academic analysis. All right. What the fuck is this? Who wants to do critical academic analysis about Rocky Fucking Horror? What is this the back to school special? Get this book learning shit out of here. Uh Sorry, John. Uh but you absolutely nailed it. Uh We're not just talking about academic analysis. No, no, no, no, no. That would be far too broad of a topic. And as I'm sure, you know, working in academia, uh, all good heady research papers have to have much, much longer and much more specific titles than academic. Rocky Horror. No, no, no, no, no, no. This week we're gonna be jacking it too. Uh Jacob, if you don't mind, three podcast hosts, analyze Be just and fear not warring visions of righteous decadence and pragmatic Justice in Rocky Horror. An essay by Thomas G. Andres featured in reading Rocky Horror, the Rocky Horror picture Show and Popular Culture. A collection of essays edited by Jeffrey Andrew Weinstock. Did, did this like a real thing. Someone put in the world like a real essay someone made about the meaning of Rocky Horror. Oh, yeah. I, I own this book that this is published in. Wow, that is pretty. That's something, huh? Yeah. Fucking spank me and call me Durkheim. Durkan is widely referred to as the father of sociology. Oh, yeah. Daddy Sociology. For those of you that haven't recently taken a one on one course. Hi father, I'm John. Oh, that's not even how that works. Where did you even get this shit? I just said it, John. Weren't you listening? No, because I haven't been in school for seven years. Um Reading Rocky horror. It's a book of essays about Rocky that was published in 2008. So we're specifically going to talk about one essay from the book. Uh Mostly because I've only read a couple of the chapters. Uh and this is one of those chapters that I've read. So, uh to be frank, uh to be honest, uh these are all a little difficult to get through, including this one. Uh But I think we might be able to, you know, translate it to a format that speaks to our listeners. Whoa, whoa, whoa Aaron. Are you telling me that? An essay about the meaning of Rocky Horror is a little difficult to get through? I don't believe it. Fuck you. You're lying to me it down. You mean you can't call them dumb Jacob. The proper nomenclature is intellectually ignorant. I, I don't think that's right, like at all. Whatever. Listen up dummies we got some learning to do. OK? Uh Let's, let's start off easy. Uh Jacob uh as the stand in for our listeners, what would you say is the theme of Rocky Horror overall? What is the one phrase or term or whatever that best represents? What Rocky Horror is all about. Easy. Don't dream it be it. Even people who haven't seen Rocky Horror know that. Well, they, they probably don't but they could wrong what? I don't know what movie you've been watching for the last three years, but that ain't it, buddy. It's far from it. All right, John, lay it on it. What do you think the primary theme of Rocky is? I think it's pretty obvious they even write it on the screen and they show it to you at the beginning of the movie. The theme of Rocky as shown during the wedding scene is be just in fear. Not obviously. What the fuck does that mean? Come on. What if I told you according to Thomas G Andres, that's the guy who wrote the essay that we're talking about. Uh You guys are both correct. I'd say that sounded like a rather sloppy way to write a segment introduction, but this isn't my script. So whatever. Yeah. Hold on there. I'm not sure about this. I've certainly never really thought much about the other messages hidden in Rocky Beyond. Don't dream it be it but be just in fear not is a bit of a stretch. You're gonna have to be a little more specific than that. I think I'm gonna need you to explain the opinion that you just put in my mouth. So, yeah. OK. Uh The crux of this viewpoint basically boils down to Rocky horror having two different parallel and competing messages expressed through the movie's narrative. OK? One is the idea of righteous decadence. That's the don't dream it be it that advocates in favor of hedonism and revels in pleasure seeking. The second is a conservative sense of pragmatic justice. That's the be just and fear not, that serves as a warning against taking a hedonistic flamboyant lifestyle, which leads to its natural self-destructive conclusion. So what the author of this essay presents uniquely is that he asserts that both themes are equally valid in the context of Rocky and that the conflict between these two different narratives actually takes place within the film itself. You literally see these two conflicting world views battling it out on screen. Well, OK, I guess those words I said were pretty smart then. Yeah, actually now that you explained it, can John and I swap, I want the conservative one. Don't dream it be. It is so boring. That's been the community's talking point for the last 46 years. It's true. Like if I'm being interviewed as part of the New York cast or just talking about Rocky in general, you know that I'm going to mention, don't dream it be it like that Rocky is a place where everyone can come and part of the antiquated term, let their freak flag fly. But you ask 100 people in the community and I'm sure you get some variation on that message. It is certainly the message that we as part of the community like to project out to the world and for all intents and purposes, it's the ideology that the community has used to represent itself since the beginning. It's the party line, right? It's OK to be who you wanna be. It's ok to indulge your hedonistic desires. It's ok to be sexually confused for boys to run around in corsets and garters to prance and dance and sing and that it's ok for girls to be sexually empowered to be naughty or slutty. And it's ok for everyone to be whoever they want to be bisexual, transsexual, whatever it is and it's ok to shoot your boss with a laser gun. Don't dream it be it, right? And most importantly, none of these things are bad or negative or make you any weirder than anyone else, especially shooting your boss with a laser gun, it's all the spectrum. And as long as you aren't actively hurting anyone else aside from your boss with a laser gun, you do you. But and I will point this out is that the message that the community likes to portray or is that the real message that's contained in the actual text of the movie, the Rocky horror picture show. Uh uh This, this is gonna get academic, isn't it? OK. I I will try super hard to avoid getting too far up our own asses. Uh But I, I do think this is actually kind of interesting is that message that we as a community project out into the wider world, actually supported by the material on film. I would argue as the author of this essay, we are referencing also argues that it definitely portrays that message for the majority of the film, but in the end, it does not win out. It is the conservative message that wins the day, the message that a self-righteous sense of hedonism is only acceptable to a point. And at which point, pragmatism takes over and a sense of justice has to be restored. Now, we're gonna have to cite some sources for that because I'm not seeing it yet. So start with Frank. Frank is the embodiment of seventies decadent morality. He is unapologetically self righteous in his worldview that anything goes as long as it's pleasurable. He creates a sexual plaything in Rocky. He seduce Brad and Janet and before them, he seduces both Columbia and Eddie. Then you have Magenta and Riffs insu relationship perfectly. Ok. In the Transylvanian worldview that places hedonism above all else as a stark contrast. You have Brad and Janet and Doctor Scott, the embodiment of moderation, the status quo and traditional morality, the exact opposite of the Transylvanian way. And these characters don't convert Frank to their righteous moral side. They are seduced by the allure of the decadence. Sure. You, you see this super early in the film, right? Janet giggling at Frank asking her if she has tattoos instead of the harsh disgust in Brad's certainly not right during the reprise to make you a man, Janet again breaks from her worldview to explain that she's now a muscle fat and right, which like gotta say one of my favorite little moments when doing Brad and Janet getting to be so disgusted with my Janet and like, call her a whore and shove her off stage. Yeah. When I'm Riff, I always like to throw Frank's gown at Janet after she sings her bit, like really trying to draw the audience's attention over to Brad's reaction to her singing before they have to go back to watching Frank and Rocky. I think you do it just because you're sick of holding Frank's gown and you don't want it to be your responsibility to get back to whoever is playing Frank. Your jabs cut deep. Jacob, they cut deep. But getting back to it, you have this whole message of Brad and Janet becoming liberated. They go to bed and it escalates with Frank seducing both of them. Frank gets them both to admit that they were into it. You liked it, didn't you all? And I mean, he literally could not hit the audience over the head harder than with. There's no crime and giving yourself over to pleasure. Sure. That's definitely the narrative that Frank is espousing and it goes on right with Janet's sexual liberation at the hands of Rocky, more like on his dick. Am I right? The criminologist sums it up that Janet has succumbed to a powerful and irrational master and like that's the whole point. It's OK for Janet to want to fuck. That's what Frank has shown her, but that's right about where it all just goes off the rails, right? With the appearance of Doctor Scott dinner scene and the film's entire third act, the entire don't dream it be it mentality begins to have consequences. Ones that we're gonna talk about more a bit later. But first, I want to take it back to the start of the film and explore some of these exact same events we've just discussed except from the point of view where pragmatic justice is the ideology that wins the day. But first, let's make sure we're on the same page when you say pragmatic justice, what you really mean is to quote, the this all comes from do the right thing or suffer the consequences. End quote. What exactly is the right thing, the traditionally moral thing because I don't think Rocky under any lens is espousing the merits of conservative morality and definitely not conservative morality more like sensible limitations. If that makes sense, it's what the sign in this cemetery says. Denton, the home of happiness. No, fuck you. The other one. Be just in fear. Not this is the idea that all this decadence that we are about to see needs to include a modicum of self restraint or you will suffer the consequences of choosing that path be just and fear. Not a a further continuation of this theme though, it's very subtle is the use of Nixon's speech in the car on the way to the castle. Like what a perfect example for the decade that Rocky was created in to showcase someone who suffers the consequences of their unrestrained exploitations of power and self indulgence. Even the literal first line of the entire movie is about that science fiction double feature opens with Michael Rennie was ill. The day the Earth stood still but he told us where we stand. And how do you figure the day the Earth stood still is a 1951 sci-fi movie. Have you ever seen it? Certainly not. Oh, well, how about you? No, not really. Uh But I can paraphrase a quote from this essay. So uh Michael Rennie in the day, the still plays a thinly disguised Christlike figure who comes from the heavens, takes the earthly name of carpenter. If the analogy wasn't obvious enough is killed by the violent masses, then is later resurrected. If it still wasn't obvious enough. And then he warns the entire world that they must repent of their evil ways or be destroyed in the film. The character is speaking of the horrors of atomic weapons, not like kinky sex, but I mean, the message is still the same Michael Rennie, like the sign outside of the church tells us where we stand. Be just and fear not. Well, I hate this. You're ruining Rocky. Speaking of Rocky. And I think this is one of the most egregious examples supporting this theory is the entirety of the song sort of Damocles as well. Read, educated smarty pants. I'm sure we all know the story of Damocles. But for the Plebeians out there, John, can you look it up for us on Wikipedia? Sure, Jacob. So Damocles is a character that appears in an ancient Greek story that demonstrates that with great fortune and power comes also with great danger. Damocles a courtier in the court of Dionysus in pandering to his king remarked that Dionysus was very fortunate being a man of great power and authority and surrounded by many treasures. In response, Dionysus offered for a little freaky Friday and switched places with Damocles for one day so that Damocles could experience being king firsthand. Damocles accepted because who wouldn't and took up the king's throne surrounded by countless luxuries. And there were many treasures, beautifully embroidered rugs, fragrant perfumes in the most selective foods, piles of silver and gold and servants unparalleled in their beauty. But Dion Isis who had made many enemies during his reign, arranged that a sword should hang above the throne suspended only by a single hair of a horse's tail to evoke the sense of what it is like to be king. Though you may have much fortune, you always have an overwhelming sense of foreboding and anxiety as there are many dangers that work to overtake your position. I thought that the story was gonna be that he got to be king for a day and then the king had many enemies and that made being the king a bad job. And so through doing the job, Dam mcclees realizes, oh no, it's actually not so cool being king. But then Dionysus just has a sword hanging over his head the whole time. So he didn't even, no one learned a lesson. Dionysus just fix the game. What the uh all the Greeks don't fuck around, man. It's just a literal story. All right. So what Rocky is singing about? That's kind of fucked up. He already knows from the moment that he is born that he is at the beginning of one giant shit storm or the start of a really big downer if you will. Oh Yeah. But yeah, exactly. Right. Rocky is already at the end of the story of Damocles, he knows that he has been brought into this world to indulge in the decadence and hedonism that's espoused by the Transylvanian way of life. But he can also see from the minute that he is granted life that he sits on a razor's edge that the thread will be cut and that his story is a tragedy. He just has to live through it. It is depressing as shit to realize that Rocky is the smartest character in the Rocky horror picture show. You know, like I never really thought about that. The song is a bop but that's some depressing shit. Oh Man. Wait till you actually listen to the lyrics of another bop bop by Hansen. Wait, what Bob has words? Oh boy, good luck on that one. So this overarching theme of Pragmatic Justice continues past, you know, Rocky being the smartest one in the whole movie. Literally to the next song, opportunity. What the fuck Hot Patuti is about banging chicks and doing meth and having a good time. It is about two of those things, but we all know that uh Jacob, you don't actually know the words to Hot Patuti on stage. We like to call you Mr Watermelon Watermelon Watermelon over there. So you know, oh my. Do you actually call me Mr Watermelon Watermelon Watermelon? Because that's a lot of verbs or sorry syllables to say in one calling of a person a thing and then yeah. No, we're good on this. No, I know them. Fuck you. Whatever happened to Saturday now. Hi. What did your sub shop? And you felt out? Right? And then there's like some other words you say, see, he's lamenting whatever did happen to those Saturday nights. Don't see the same since cosmic light came into my life. I thought I was, see, that's Eddie experiencing the blinding illusion of Frank and his way of life. That's him realizing his whole way of life is over. The entire rest of the song is him wistfully remembering all the things he used to do, going for rides with chicks, banging chicks, lipstick and hair oil and struggling with her white plastic belt. It wasn't me. It wasn't a diverse set of things he was doing. But like those are the things he used to be doing. All of them except the meth past 10, except the meth it's over since that cosmic light. Frank came into his life and he's still under the spell now. He didn't never go back. And what does he get for his troubles for believing in divine decadence? He gets an ax to the motherfucking head. Death. Frank kills him. Not for being too conservative or against his way of life. It's actually quite the opposite. He's a full blown cult member. Frank just didn't like how his new play thing reacted to his old play thing. So in a fit of he a rage, he just pummeled his old play thing to death with an ice pick and everyone was OK with it. This was before he fucked Brad and Janon and all that other shit. They were already under his spell. Only Columbia is remotely impacted by Eddie's death at least until dinner and Doctor Scott shows up, but she's not exactly despondent. We see her just relaxing on her shade lounge, reading magazines and fooling around with Magenta throughout the film Second act. But by the end of dinner scene, right, the facade is totally lifted. Frank's decadence, which I guess everyone thought was just harmless and sexual. Completely forgetting that they had just all watched him kill a guy. Uh Finally, finally, it crossed is over the line when pardon the pun cannibalism was finally on the table. You saw Janet freak the fuck out running to Rocky, which further sets off Frank who then chases Janet through the castle berating her that she still doesn't understand the true meaning of his way of life. She better wise up that she is literally still too repressed that the murder and the cannibalism is all part of the game. It's something you'll get used to a mental mind. Fuck can be nice. It's got fucking dark. What the hell Aaron I really don't like this. I know. Right. So to make it even worse, we see the only way Frank can even hold on to his reality is by freezing all of his play things and literally taking away their autonomy. He removes their free will and forces them into the floor show. So that's like perfectly fine hedonism for Frank, but it no longer is him allowing others to embrace that same world view it becomes for me and not me. And you can see all of the guilt and the regret in each one of their four show performances. Columbia's verse is basically about how she's a hollow shell. Brad is beyond confused at himself in his reality to the point of crying out for his mommy and Rocky knows that the only thing that's keeping him from a pit of trouble and pain is his unchecked libido in the orgasmic rushes of lust. You skipped Janet. Janet hasn't figured it out yet or if she has Frank still has complete control over her, she's embraced the hedonism as she puts it. Reality is here. The game has been disbanded. Frank's lust is so sincere. She is still 100% on board this crazy train. Right? And then Frank sings his self indulgent homage to well himself and his way of life. And then the entire entourage joins him for the crescendo. The height of debare. Don't dream it be it the pool scene. And finally the big kick line for wild and untamed things where they all sing about letting the party go on and on and on till life itself has gone all to keep them safe from their troubles and pains. It's a celebratory song about decadence and hedonism. But with lyrics that are very, very self-aware and how unsustainable that life is sung by people who only embrace it because they have had their entire self awareness stripped from them by Frank. And then it's done the consequences show up Riffa Magenta bust in. They take over literally. Your mission is afi your your lifestyle is too extreme. Like that's the whole kit and Caboodle for the theme of Pragmatic justice. Frank went too far and now he has to pay and Frank doesn't escape somehow subverting the consequences. He fucking dies and his creation dies. And as an audience and this is the part that made me think this whole theme kind of holds water we don't see RFF as the bad guy. You don't really see him as a traitor. We see him as a realist. We all recognize that. Yeah, Frank may have crossed a line. He probably did cross the line and yeah, better to have killed him. I mean, what was the dude gonna do next? The situation was rapidly deteriorating into some kind of crazy sex, drug murder, meth cannibal cult. What was going to happen next? And that's it. Superheroes laments the state that these characters have been left in. They're broken, confused, wrestling with the taste that they had for decadence, but reeling at the consequences, they didn't so much escape as they were abandoned and the criminologist confirms it and crawling on the planet's face. Some insects called the human race lost in time and lost in space and meaning. And that's that for an hour and 41 minutes, the audience gets to share Frank's righteous sense of decadence. We all get to be hedonistic little assholes, hogging the limelight running around in our underwear, not dreaming it but being it. But in the end, the lights come up and the outcome remains the same pragmatic justice prevails. We all hang our costumes up in our closets because we know that you can only Prince around high off your ass for so long before some jackass with the taser shows up and kills your course at wearing ass. So I largely I agree with parts of this. Absolutely. I see the don't dream it be it. And I see Frank getting punished for his too much like his two, his excesses. But I don't think that's why he's killed. I don't think it's because of his excesses. I've always seen Rocky Horror through the lens of power and for a bunch of the movie, Frank has the power because he's super sexual and everyone likes him and he just commands things and things are very social. So people like him a lot and also towards the end, he has the power to just freeze people. So he gets to enjoy himself and have a good time. He gets to don't dream it be it because he has power or to then Riff and Magenta get disgruntled and so they kill him. And so I always thought the message was like, yeah, you can have as much fun as you want or you can try. But the second someone around you doesn't like you and they have more power than you. It's over for you. So you, you have, you do what you want but beware of the people around you. I don't think you're too far off with that. Jacob. Honestly, I feel like that kind of comes hand in hand. Like if we get really philosophical up in this bitch, like I feel like that thought process about like the dynamic of power and what it can do to people kind of falls a little bit in line with pragmatic justice. But I think that the lens in which people see that from, like when we talk about pragmatic justice, we're kind of talking a lot through the lens of Frank and you're talking about the lens through everybody who is like underneath him. And I feel like it's kind of apples and oranges. But at the same time, there is a relationship because when there is somebody who is disliking the person who in their mind is acting out of hedonistic desires, they find a way to shut them down. And that's their example of pragmatic justice. There's actually a really good point to, to tie into this about uh how Frank sees himself as the creator, right? He becomes godlike in his creation of Rocky. And then there's the whole allegory with like them being killed and, you know, when they fall into the pool and you've got the picture of Adam right on there. And it's like, oh he has been, he has been smoke for his, like trying to become an all powerful God and like, he has been brought back down, you know, and, and destroyed because of it. It's kind of a weird thing that this, this essay also brought that shit up, but like, I didn't put any of that in here because I didn't really know how to tie it in. But apparently you guys do right on or theologians or some shit. Yeah. That's what we are. I really did not like this one. Can we go back to? Don't dream it be it, please. This is a fucking downer. I mean, you're right, Aaron. But seriously, hey, don't worry, guys, we can always take solace in that other eternal gem of wisdom. The true meaning of rocky horror. Be just and fear not be slow and miss the bus. And that's our show. We would like to thank Charles Sanders, Pearce. He invented pragmatism in reality. We'd also like to thank Josh over at the irrational masters sent us a write in a couple of weeks ago. I have been slow rolling the crap out of that one. Hunting and hunting and hunting for some good sources. I promise we're going to get to it very, very soon. Thank you so much for being patient. If anyone has a question, they'd like us to answer on air for Nicky asks a question or some community news they'd like us to talk about or even a cool story to share with the community about their meth. We'd love to include it in our show. Just go to our website rocky talkie podcast dot com and fill out our contact form to tell us about it. If you're enjoying Rocky Horror, please help us out by rating reviewing and subscribing to the show. It makes the podcast more accessible to new listeners which really helps us to grow the show. And if you want even more Rocky talky content. Check us out on Facebook, youtube, Instagram and tiktok all at Rocky Talkie Podcast. And after we all digest that existential dread, we'll talk to you next week. Bye. Was that existential threat overtaken? You will never ever catch me reading a fucking Rocky horror book. Would catch me reading a book. Period. Let alone something about Rocky John. We know you can't read. You don't need to pretend like it's just rocky stuff. Hello. Hello, Kitty. Sorry. One second, the cat's going nuts over here. Hold on. I can't really be saying hello. Oh my God. Does the cat vomit everywhere? Hey, we can't come back. Sorry. He's scratching at the door like so much that you could, you're gonna be able to hear it in the recording. Oops, we ordered hot dogs. Oops, I, nobody said you had to take them out of the can. Oh my God. There's hardcore. Then there's hard core knock people out in past episodes. We've talked about her new cameo count and how much she seems to be enjoying getting off. Mm mm No. How much she seems to be enjoying goofing off with her fans throughout these videos. Uh Boo boo community boobs, boobies, boobies. Oh community booze. I like that community boobs community boobs. The piece is a 3D design featuring featuring Franken Furter sealed in Franken Furter, Frank Frank N Henry an, what's an re that's how you pronounce Henry. It's Andre oh gee. It's a French Storm. Yep. Oh, love you. And after we all fuck, oh God, you never burp through your words.